TOP Print Sales: The Back End Going Forward

Some goods news—

I've been working hard on some "back-end" stuff, filing forms with the county and so forth, and I thought I'd bring you up to speed on a few details pertaining to TOP Print Offers for 2019.

First, We're partnering with an e-commerce firm and a local bank to take credit cards directly. We'll be able to take all major credit cards, including international orders from anywhere in the world with instant automatic currency conversion. For all future sales that TOP runs (this doesn't pertain to sales run by the featured photographers themselves), we'll accept only credit cards, which hopefully will mean minimal hassle for you as well as for me—no more old-timey snail-mailed checks which take so long to process*, and no more need for PayPal.

Second, We'll have a professional bookkeeper handling everything from the orders to the mailing labels, including all the accounting**.

Third, I've narrowed the field down to several options of printmaking service bureaus to partner with. We might use more than one, but I'd like to work with one consistently because my experience has been that practice makes perfect when creative people work together repeatedly. The leading contender is a small atelier in Philadelphia that can do the printing and shipping for photographers who don't do it themselves. They are excellent, highly experienced printmakers with very fine equipment, yet they're still a small shop with individualized, hands-on service and personalized attention. Artists themselves, they will work with our photographers to get the 'master prints' just right before committing to a run.

Reader print offers
The real hidden benefit here? It means we'll have the potential to work with a greatly enlarged pool of photographers...including TOP readers.

It's always been a balancing act to find just the right photographers to partner with. For years, I've lived in fear that we might one day venture a sale with an unreliable partner who might fail to follow through. That could damage or even ruin the reputation we've worked hard to build. It's always been a very high priority for me for that to never happen.

My son Xander holding the Lincoln Memorial print
by TOP reader David Dyer-Bennet. It now hangs
in my living room here in the Finger Lakes.

If, on the other hand, TOP oversees all the printing, bookkeeping, and fulfillment work, and takes those aspects of sales out of the artists' hands, then we'll be free to work with nearly any good photographer. Even if a photographer doesn't normally do his or her own printing, even if they're unwilling or unable to accept payments or manage shipping and handling, we'll still be able to potentially choose a photograph or photographs of theirs to offer. We did that several times in the past with Ctein handling all the printing and fulfillment, and it worked very well (for example, the highly successful Kate Kirkwood sale).

Because the cost of some of these services is monthly, it would make sense to have small sales more often. We could even get the point of having a "reader picture of the month." I don't know about you, but I think that would be satisfying—bringing physical prints into the world in multiple copies that wouldn't otherwise exist as such.

Just the discussions of which images deserve to be chosen could be interesting for everyone, even for those who aren't selling or buying.

The system remains to be tested, of course, and I assume things will run more smoothly as we get some practice under our belts. But I'm excited by the possibilities. Could open the door to some good fun, going forward.

Mike

* The bookkeeper said, rather darkly, "not waiting for personal checks to clear is not good bookkeeping."

** Given my aptitudes for that kind of work, this is a very good thing, my brothers and sisters, believe you me.  :-)

Original contents copyright 2018 by Michael C. Johnston and/or the bylined author. All Rights Reserved. Links in this post may be to our affiliates; sales through affiliate links may benefit this site.

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(To see all the comments, click on the "Comments" link below.)
Featured Comments from:

John Krumm: "I have the Lincoln photo hanging in my living room too. This all sounds great, but you just over promised. Since you are from the Midwest, you should know that one secret to happiness is under promising and then over delivering."

Mike replies: You could be right, but I don't think I'm promising...no specifics, and no timetable mentioned. Just a report of the work I've done so far and why.

David Dyer-Bennet: "More frequent, smaller, sales might be very interesting.

"Very pleased to hear that print found a place in your living room! And yeah, before the details were fully worked out (Ctein ended up handling print-making and fulfillment) I was a little scared of that part, never having handled anything like it myself before. So I was entirely pleased with how that was done.

"One minor thing—will the new system accept PayPal? You're emphasizing not requiring it, which is good, but I tend to keep my playing-around money in PayPal, and having to shift it somewhere to use it would be a disadvantage."

Mike replies: If enough people feel that way, I'll keep it in mind. We tend to get lots of complaints about PayPal; many people refuse to use it. And the fees at this end are high.

MikeR: "I like the sound of this. You don't want to be making it up as you go along. The more you can establish a process and routine, the smoother that things will flow. That should help with keeping administrative costs low as well. (Make it up with volume!!) Kate Kirkwood's print 'Sunrise Cow' hangs in my living room. The DD-B Lincoln one is by my printer, and your print of fishing at a lake is by my monitor (an NEC PA272W, like yours. I love it!)."

Rodolfo Canet: "Sorry if I'm missing something but if the printing is done by an external service, will the copies be signed by the author?

Mike replies: Generally not. Everyone's experience is that shipping prints to be signed results in a lot of handling loss. Plus, the benefit of signed prints is almost always for one of two reasons: because the artist is an accomplished  fine printmaker and has crafted the print personally and is attesting to that fact, or because the artist is famous and the signature is a token that they touched the print themselves and approved the way the print looks. (Andy Warhol once signed blank sheets of printmaking paper and sold each for $5,000.)

In the art photography world these days, buyers generally do want signed prints, but they like them signed on the back, not on the front. The use is for provenance and to attest to the vintage (date) of the printing, rather than for display.

If the photographer is a.) unknown and b.) didn't craft the print him- or herself, I'm not sure how a signature provides added value.

But you tell me—how do you feel about it?

Of course Peter's prints will be signed—he believes in it strongly and doesn't sell unsigned prints. But he's a name photographer with literally thousands of publishing credits who has published many books and has been honored with a retrospective exhibition at a major national museum. That's a far cry from many readers who are dedicated enthusiasts but have either modest art-world resumés to no such credentials at all.

For Chester's sale in December, we might try a "virtual signature" outside the image area. He's sent me an image of his signature and we're thinking of printing it on the lower right, in the white border outside the image, in an unobtrusive light gray color. Whether we do it or not depends on how he and I and the printer feel about it once we see it. I'm hoping this will serve the purpose of attesting to his authorship of the picture without at the same time fooling anybody into thinking it's an original signature, which is not the intent. And its position on the page gives the purchaser the option of allowing it to show or not show when the picture is matted. Chester lives in a remote location, so shipping prints to him to sign doesn't seem practical. Given the inevitable losses, the time it would take, and the extra shipping costs and so forth, it would add significantly to the cost of each print. 

None of this means we would stop selling signed prints, in cases where it's appropriate or desirable, or in cases where the photographer simply prefers it that way.

Rodolfo replies to Mike: " I understand, and even agree to all reasons stated in your kind reply. I'm nonetheless, quite a fetishistic guy about objects and I've gone to some lengths to get even modest prints from my friends signed. So, yes, an unsigned print will be of less interest to me, even if I'm the first one to see that it really makes little sense."

Comments

[Huw Morgan]

Why so down on Paypal. I like it better than giving my credit card to some unknown local bank that may not have the best credit card security.

[Timo]

Terrific news, Mike -- please keep up the good work.

[Kenneth Tanaka]

Sounds like very smart moves to leap that gap between pastime and business.

[Gunny]

All for it!

[Dave Karp]

I have that Lincoln print hanging in my office. It has gotten several very positive commments. Thanks to DDB for that.

I second the idea of more frequent sales. I can't always participate, but I have some very nice pieces that I never would have been able to collect in the absence of your sales. Thanks to Mike and the other photographers for that.

[Del Bomberger]

You might have a hard time believing how often I don't put down the laptop to go get my credit card to buy something offered online. If its PayPal, I do it frequently. Just my two cents.

[Marco]

What about the photo of the week/month and then a TOP print sale with no profit for the photographer? excluding professionals by design, this would give exposure to outsiders that would be more than pleased just to know that his/her photo has been appreciated by a valuable audience.

[Richard Parkin]

Good news! But this is so sensible I doubt you’ll ever follow through. A question: “credit cards”, does that include bank cards (as we call them in UK, so maybe a terminology problem), ie sakes credit cards but not credit.

[Michael Perini]

I would only add that you were a custom printer.
You have a new printing machine that you could use to pay yourself instead of someone else.
My advice would be to take the initiative to start a custom printing business.
Even if TOP print sales are your only client, you would make more money, your printer would get the exercise it needs, and people would probably get better prints.
You would charge the same as the outsourced price, and make the same profit they would make.
You could still hire a book keeper and maybe get that same person to do the fulfillment.
Seems like a no brainer to me.

[I might move into doing that at some point when it's comfortable, but for now the real goal is to minimize the workload so that decisions can be made independently of those concerns. Quite honestly, I already have enough to do...you haven't seen that X-H1 review yet, have you? (tugging uncomfortably at shirt collar) --Mike]

[David Dyer-Bennet]

This is embarrassing. You know why I want prints signed, or something like it? So I can keep track of who they are by in the future! However, there are many ways besides signing-on-the-front to achieve that, including my writing it on the back in pencil when I receive it. (So, now that I've realized this, I can just take care of it in any future cases, and you don't have to worry about my weird needs.)

[Jack]

Huw asked why so down on Pay Pal?
I refuse to use Pay Pal for my own purchases and am always willing to supply my credit card since the charges instantly are reported on my phone.

As a photographer whose print was offered in a TOP sale awhile ago, I still remember the panic when I had shipped all the prints at quite a bit of labor and expense and Pay Pal shut down my account and said “tough luck” until Mike talked me down from a cliff with the words, “Relax they do that to everyone new.” In the end after imploring to Pay Pal by phone ( and good luck getting a phone call answered ) that I was not stealing people’s money and the buyers already had the product, I got the funds released in dribbles over several months. If I were Mike I would stick to the idea of NO PayPal.

And Mike, while I truly love the idea of you starting up the print sales again, please postpone Michael’s suggestion you start your own printing business. We need your time spent writing not printing.

[Eolake]

I must say I do love when there is a Paypal option. It’s just one click, no filling in a cc number and address.

[Jim Hamstra]

I have a large collection of photos and never buy photos that are not signed. I also sign every photo of mine I sell.
At photography shows I have seen dealers sell prints that are decades old of unknown photographers and the signed prints are more valuable than those unsigned.
It just seems that the signature says that the photographer feels it is a print he is willing to put out there as his work. For example, I never sign a work print.
Cheers, Jim

[adamct]

I care much less about a signature than I do about being able to prove / remember who the print is from. From my perspective, it is just as valuable (maybe even more so) to print the name of the picture, the print date, and the photographer’s name in the corner, as it is for the print to be signed. I like it to be out of the image area, preferably centered below the print in black ink. That way I can decide whether to cut a window in the matte to show the information, or cover it up (but have it there, if ever needed). Frankly, I don’t care at all about resale value (I buy pictures I like — if I like them, I don’t want to sell them), but I care a lot about being able to find the photographer in the future, in case I want to buy / explore more of their work. Too often I can’t remember the name of the photographer...

...and I’m only 41!!!

Best regards,
Adam

[Manfred WInter]

I also would prefer Paypal. Hated them but recently made my peace with them; not because they are better or more reliable than before (They're not!) but because the endless list of failure and issues reported with online CC Processing.
On another topic: What has happened with the TOP Photo book offerings? Retired? Under the weather? Dying a slow death? On vacation?

[Kenneth Tanaka]

Is a signature important? That depends on what you (Mike) are selling and what buyers think they are buying. The essential objective of a signature is, of course, authentication. If you’re going to sell a print of an image made by a committed artist with a catalog of collected work then yes, a signature will be absolutely essential to establish a line of provenance even if the buyer has no intention to sell it. If the print will just be a nice image made by a hobbyist/non-artist who is has not established a genuine collectible catalog of work no, a signature is not essential. The buyers are buying the image, not the artist.

As an example of sales that represent something in the middle, I have been purchasing prints offered by Magnum’s various print sales. These prints are, of course, of works made by some of the best known photographers in the world many (but not all) of whom are quite established as collectible artists. Many of the prints are mass-produced ink jets produced by a service that can also mount and frame them (at additional cost). Each print has come bearing some form of authentication. All have a Magnum stamp on the back. Some, by living artists, feature a genuine signature on the back. Prints of deceased artists’ works bear an estate stamp on the back.

So one potential compromise would be to have the printer place a customized authentication sticker on the back of each print. It’s a bit cheesy (and would never serve as genuine authentication in the art world) but it’s often done in tourist galleries and seems to make many buyers happy.

[D. Hufford]

I think this is a smart move. Nothing brings me more panic than the rare person wanting to purchase a print from a photo that they have seen online. I have declined to do so for the last 7 or 8 years.

The stress of wondering if they will like the print like they did the online version, the depressing thought of trying to perfect a print for someone who is paying hard cash for it, the attempting to fulfill a request to print a photo at a larger size than it should be printed, the packing, and often international shipping is just more than I want at less than about gazillion dollars per print. Were I ever to agree to do one for someone, I supposed my printer would choose that time to repeatedly clog it heads, create mysterious banding, or flat out die. The only thing I have common with Cartier-Bresson would be to get someone to do my printing to my satisfaction for me, even if nobody ever see it be me.

I hated darkroom printing, and now I am coming to hate printer-printing. At least darkrooms didn't break down so often.

[Ian Seward]

Interesting comments on PayPal. As I am in the UK PayPal is just extra "cost" in the system and you lose security.

In the UK credit card companies (VISA / MasterCard) are responsible for any fraud, not the customer, unless the customer is committing the fraud. Guess it is not like that in the USA?

Actually someone said that chip and pin, rather than signature is still used in USA. Hard to believe for us, is it true?

Ian

[BrettSimison]

In the art photography world these days, buyers generally do want signed prints, but they like them signed on the back, not on the front. The use is for provenance and to attest to the vintage (date) of the printing, rather than for display.

I used to sign prints in pencil on the front of my matte BW prints, but I've never liked the look of an ink signature on my luster inkjets. For a long time, I stopped signing on the front and just signed in pencil on the back. A large majority of my customers wanted their prints signed on the front, so much so that many of them would bring the prints back to me for signing, or ask that I visit their frame shop to sign before it was framed.

I’ve since relented and sign everything on the front. I’m not at all famous and the “art world” explanation didn’t hold any weight with my customers.

[Michael Perini]

Re the question of signing prints.
Putting your signature on your work, weather you are a painter, Photographer or cabinet maker is for me a way of saying 'I'm sending this off into the world as a representation of 'the best I have to give'.
I stand by it.
It is not so much about adding value, though in some cases it clearly does, or an ego thing to say 'I am an artist' I really don't worry about that stuff at all. It is a Maker's Mark.
It is one of the reasons I like physical prints so much-- it takes away the weasel room of 'You should see this on a calibrated display" The print has a finality to it.

I also realize that you have real logistical issues because the prints are being made by a service bureau.
I suppose photographers could provide small signed archival 'stickers' with the photographer's name and date with a signature below to be included with each print--- that would at least provide identification into the future.
Signing your work is an important thing, I think.
m

[Harry Lew]

Hi, Mike. Love to see you're cranking up the print sales big time. They're a win/win/win for all concerned. On a related topic, any plans to also rev up your book sale ventures with participating museum shops? I participated in two of those in recent years and would love to do so again. (Sorry, I know that makes for extra work!)

[Greg Boiarsky]

If you move to more frequent, smaller sales you might consider creating a judging board. That is, get a diverse group of judges to look at submissions and decide which images(s) to offer.